埃德蒙顿华人社区-Edmonton China

 找回密码
 注册
查看: 2493|回复: 9

What is "income trust"?

[复制链接]
鲜花(11) 鸡蛋(0)
发表于 2006-11-1 22:08 | 显示全部楼层 |阅读模式
老杨团队,追求完美;客户至上,服务到位!
hello investment experts,: Y+ |; W/ F  I. S7 ^
please give some clue about this.; C5 `& G# X$ ~9 o- ^' v
thanks,
鲜花(3) 鸡蛋(0)
发表于 2006-11-1 23:38 | 显示全部楼层
Almost all mutual fund companies are trust companies. Trust company doesn’t pay tax, it only flows income to unit holders, and taxed in the unit holder’s hands. Whereas Corporates are double taxed. - }' f/ J5 r  Y* t; \0 |3 a
) f0 W8 `( Q; t" n
The Federal government’ move is to stop big Corporate such as BCE and Telus to convert to trust company to prevent tax revenue loses.
鲜花(0) 鸡蛋(0)
发表于 2006-11-1 23:52 | 显示全部楼层

Canada's Income Trusts, BCE, Telus May Plunge on New Taxes

Nov. 1 (Bloomberg) -- Canadian income trusts may plunge today after the government said it plans to impose taxes on the high-yield securities to halt a slide in tax revenue and stem a flood of trust conversions by companies such as BCE Inc. and Telus Corp.
6 G/ u" c' Y, _$ O( c: H! ^5 k5 D, a2 t, i7 a  v
Finance Minister Jim Flaherty said late yesterday he will start taxing income trusts for the first time, and raise dividend tax rates for pension funds and foreign investors that own trusts. The changes would go into effect next year for new trusts, while existing securities will be exempt until 2011. ' P" @) T9 A7 q) q* j5 u

" A- n, i0 f/ d% c9 f``There's no question what's going to happen, there's going to be a sell-off,'' said John Dielwart, chief executive officer of ARC Energy Trust, a Canadian oil and natural gas producer based in Calgary. : {3 x7 |+ U0 N! ~

9 \+ N" |7 K4 dThe tax changes put a dent in the fastest growing segment of the Toronto Stock Exchange, and may halt some of the C$70 billion ($62 billion) in new trust conversions announced in recent weeks by firms such as BCE. The number of trusts in Canada has tripled to about 250, and their market value has soared 20-fold in six years to C$200 billion. $ g( _* h( i5 E/ L+ u$ {

: c4 h1 C; a- HThe decisions by BCE and Telus, Canada's two biggest phone companies, to become trusts to reduce taxes may have forced the government's hand, investors said. These two firms alone would have increased the market value of trusts by C$50 billion, boosting the government's tax losses from trusts to C$800 million a year. Trusts avoid most corporate taxes by paying out their cash flow to investors in monthly dividends. 2 A2 h7 @7 z+ t: S

0 p* w2 k* b; G2 K4 tSurprise Move
# b6 {% _' c+ n: G1 n; l5 A. K4 h. o  h+ c, n& g5 m
The tax measures caught many income trust executives and investors off guard, as they expected the minority government would be unwilling to make such an unpopular change until after the next election. ; ]! S: h* A8 Z# d

- e) G  T; l5 t& u# Z5 B6 q4 I  z% F``Things changed a great deal this year and we're faced with a situation where Canada was moving to an income trust economy,'' Flaherty told reporters in Ottawa last night. ``For months there has been a growing trend toward corporate tax avoidance.''
" k( O- |% N" p- [
1 A6 a* Q# R' z% u% w3 F8 NBCE, Canada's biggest phone company, has gained 15 percent over the past two months as investors anticipated a switch to the structure. The company announced plans to convert its Bell Canada unit to a trust on Oct. 11. Flaherty said the structure isn't ``suitable'' for phone companies.
+ U, q6 C% t, ^6 O; U; g  ^( {: V! c) E1 H7 H; v
BCE spokesman Pierre Leclerc didn't return a call seeking comment, and Telus spokesman Shawn Hall declined to comment. BCE and Telus don't qualify for the four-year exemption as their conversions haven't been completed.
8 A1 s5 w  y8 K1 l# ^- F/ V% B# s+ q% c8 g0 j7 l/ \# C0 T$ p
``The government had to address the problem sooner or later, said Denis Durand, a senior partner at Jarislowsky Fraser Ltd. in Montreal, which oversees C$58.5 billion, and is ``marginally'' invested in income trusts. ``There was a concern that too many unsuitable companies and industries would try to convert and that would affect the reinvestment process.''
1 W. L. ~: F, N3 O& U" r, l, m  S
; _8 E/ Z1 k% S- G! N: n8 _9 E; pStock Gains % k" o! }3 e1 ?
9 |/ Q6 B5 z# c5 r& B+ X: T
BCE's stock rose 3 cents yesterday in Toronto trading to C$31.70. Shares of Telus, which announced plans to convert Sept. 11, have jumped 24 percent since then. Other companies that have announced plans to take advantage of the income trust structure include Dundee Wealth Management Inc., an asset-management firm, that plans to sell a minority stake in its Goodman & Co. mutual fund arm through an initial public offering of trust units.
7 b  e6 a/ [2 j8 B6 z
: e- V. D& V: K8 Q. R* o; d7 K``We knew there were more coming,'' Flaherty said, adding that there have been C$70 billion worth of trust conversions announced this year. ``It's absolutely necessary to act on this issue in the interest of fairness.'' : @6 m  V+ k2 C* M

* t1 j, q9 y4 e: ~Income trusts are also expected to decline as the increased taxes on payouts will make them less attractive for investors. Until this year, the returns for the S&P/TSX Capped Income Trust Index, including dividends, have topped the benchmark S&P/TSX index each year since 1999. Canadian Oil Sands Trust, the largest trust on the index, is up 41 percent, including dividends, over the past year.
: u( ~% m( s9 {: f, n  I0 p( Y" Z6 \% u5 H) w5 \9 ]4 U$ K/ ?
`Nasty' ! a" z5 D9 ~$ e; c( z! k% ], C
" \4 ~- ]% t! L. ]$ n4 Y
The announcement ``is going to deliver some pretty nasty re- evaluations of all the trusts,'' Marcel Coutu, chief executive of Canadian Oil Sands, said in a telephone interview. ``We'll certainly be thinking about how it impacts us and how the trust sector is going to evolve from here.'' 9 D$ @4 v* w5 r$ j& I7 R
5 Z& `, n: U! S8 {7 [9 `
The government plans to tax trusts in much the same way it taxes corporations. As a result, trusts will no longer be allowed to deduct for income taxes the payouts they make to shareholders. Income will then be taxed at a rate of 31.5 percent by 2011, the finance department said in a statement yesterday. Real estate investment trusts, or REITs, will be exempt as they are in the U.S.
* j* d" d7 l% S  b5 H% U: n' r" D' w
The changes will effectively raise the tax rates for investors in tax-sheltered retirement accounts, pension funds, and for U.S. investors. The U.S. shareholders, who pay a 15 percent withholding tax on their trust dividends, will be paying a tax rate of 41.5 percent in 2011, the government said. Tax- exempt Canadian pensions will pay 31.5 percent, according to the finance department. Individual investors would continue to pay about 46 percent on trust payouts. 9 B6 u) ?, F' b- F. z2 j

0 E' p3 D2 e) c- FPolitical Minefield
; S( a+ j* ]6 @8 d% m' T# w/ e5 L2 E. o6 ~
The income trust issue has been a political minefield in Canada over the past two years. Trusts lost billions of dollars in market value last year when the previous Liberal government said it might change the tax rules, prompting Flaherty's Conservative Party to pledge in the campaign for elections in January that it would not tax trusts if it won power. " \/ b; G. Q; @3 I& f3 n
. B3 v' K' A6 K! Q$ _
Rather than tax trusts, the previous Liberal Party government cut dividend taxes to reduce companies' incentive to convert to trusts, a move Flaherty said didn't go far enough. 6 Y. I0 M7 J. r
& H2 n  s/ x* s; m0 }0 a$ c- e$ N0 g
Prime Minister Stephen Harper's government will feel pressure to reverse course, said William Lacey, a trust analyst at Calgary-based FirstCapital Energy Capital Corp.
  \5 F+ ?. \8 x6 o% p  d* h( U0 F3 q: }. E0 H2 u' f
``When you state something like this that impacts so many of their constituents, nothing is written in stone,'' Lacey said in a telephone interview. # C7 d# p9 j1 E  F

' g( {) @- U3 g1 b( F% s; ?3 m4 aMinority ' e/ N" O" @. p
) b- H: S7 K, A. C! P3 p1 D
The Conservative Party lacks a majority of seats in Parliament and needs support from opposition parties to pass laws. The New Democratic Party, which had called a moratorium on new income trusts earlier this month, may be ready to support the plan, Judy Wasylycia-Leis, head of financial affairs for the party, said in a telephone interview. 0 ]6 u8 k! p; |+ R. v8 p' i) x; L

. i1 N) ~, `- k9 O- x; ]To help soften the blow, Flaherty announced C$6.5 billion in additional tax cuts over six years, mostly for seniors, including a plan to allow income-splitting for pensioners as of next year.
9 b$ V5 I+ |- r7 c/ o
3 m/ n1 A9 X# Q  \The government also said it will cut the corporate income tax rate by one-half percentage point as of Jan. 1, 2011, and increase the age credit amount by C$1,000 to C$5,066.
鲜花(0) 鸡蛋(0)
发表于 2006-11-2 10:02 | 显示全部楼层
老杨团队 追求完美
借题请教一下:Income Trust 和股票到底有什么不同? 如果也开始收税了,多少价格才算是合理的价格? 这两天疯狂下跌,怕怕。。。。
鲜花(0) 鸡蛋(0)
发表于 2006-11-2 20:01 | 显示全部楼层
顶顶,有懂行的专家吗?
5 k  \; R5 f$ H, \  j6 Q$ Y3 m8 \" B+ i, _$ F
另,这两天财长大人一句话,让加拿大人损失200亿。可不可以告他啊?
鲜花(23) 鸡蛋(0)
发表于 2006-11-2 22:10 | 显示全部楼层
原帖由 多伦多来客 于 2006-11-2 19:01 发表6 a8 K, H" N3 K7 U* u- t
顶顶,有懂行的专家吗?$ k0 s0 `- H! c3 C3 B; m) Z
4 {$ B8 b; @/ B9 G- b
另,这两天财长大人一句话,让加拿大人损失200亿。可不可以告他啊?

+ q4 Y6 p' f' f6 Y2 R  y. ?- ?, J* e8 _. [+ ?6 V! g
只要投資,不管什麼樣的都有風險,你就別做夢了。
鲜花(0) 鸡蛋(0)
发表于 2006-11-3 10:41 | 显示全部楼层
老杨团队,追求完美;客户至上,服务到位!
还以为这种政策性的风险只有中国股市才有,没想到加拿大一点也不次。
" h( R$ P# b) J! @& l
老柳教车
鲜花(0) 鸡蛋(0)
发表于 2006-11-5 00:51 | 显示全部楼层
加拿大政府效率不低啊,动作很快,一个月就把telus和bell封杀了,害的跟班小兄弟倒霉,lobby工作没做好。
2 L8 M& U9 \9 ?( A0 y不过客观的说,这个税收政策的名字是tax fairness,本着对其它公司公平的原则,如果不控制更多的公司转为trust,那么联邦财政也就没钱收了。所谓的羊毛出在羊身上,如果不是买了trust unit的人,联邦的税当然最后会用的老百姓身上。不过对老人影响比较大,不是也有相关的补助措施吗。( I( K9 X8 Y) Q6 A
当然了,联邦税-公司出;公司转嫁老百姓,联邦税服务于老百姓。所以绕来绕去,就是要保证游戏的fairness,谈不上损失什么200亿了。那200亿本来就是虚的,前期抬上去的而已。& A$ U. \% }  o* t% \9 l% ]
+ G$ m: p- z/ _& o: y" I" v
从我本人利益,不希望有此政策。不过第一咱没这一票,就是有了,都不知道该怎么投了。保守党都把自己的一些兄弟得罪了,看来这两年公司转trust整个避税过程确实有些太投机了,报告上不是说了吗?美国、澳大利亚都实施了类似的补救措施了。所以已经转的了公司,也不是损失了多少,只是少赚了些。就这还给4年的过渡。都这样想的话,就不会赶着抛trust的股票了 + L0 ^7 `1 ^* m  W$ @* v. \& T7 _1 d/ U

2 L, H; g6 f+ X1 D8 T/ T
原帖由 多伦多来客 于 2006-11-2 19:01 发表$ C" s& r! ^9 p& M. m. H
顶顶,有懂行的专家吗?
/ I  \2 J' G; |3 Q; j7 M9 l
! t" {5 P) X! R另,这两天财长大人一句话,让加拿大人损失200亿。可不可以告他啊?
鲜花(0) 鸡蛋(0)
发表于 2006-11-6 12:59 | 显示全部楼层
老杨团队,追求完美;客户至上,服务到位!
原帖由 爱家的另一半 于 2006-11-4 23:51 发表; X' C3 H+ f2 R9 Y. q' Y8 c
谈不上损失什么200亿了。那200亿本来就是虚的,前期抬上去的而已。
9 q' G* c4 ]6 x# {$ X$ B- i
! ]: ^: O7 ~7 c8 p$ v, k8 c
200亿对长期持有的人来说是虚,对出政策前买入的人来说,可是真真切切的肉哦。 ' R! S$ H- N2 z+ ?8 {9 E& H3 |
从fairness来说,是不是应该从将来多收的税里面来补偿这部分损失?
Z
鲜花(0) 鸡蛋(0)
发表于 2006-11-6 17:34 | 显示全部楼层
老杨团队,追求完美;客户至上,服务到位!
原帖由 爱家的另一半 于 2006-11-4 23:51 发表
! m5 w5 }5 y( K7 k7 [加拿大政府效率不低啊,动作很快,一个月就把telus和bell封杀了,害的跟班小兄弟倒霉,lobby工作没做好。
3 S/ e0 s) J5 S3 t不过客观的说,这个税收政策的名字是tax fairness,本着对其它公司公平的原则,如果不控制更多的公司转 ...
- |( E) J  D: u; {; f
* X  @/ X; e. M: M" n+ ~: u0 j

2 {* F3 G, f9 {收税我没意见,但是我对税的方式有意见,而且也没有“fairness”可言。一个政府,政策宽也好,严也好,最怕的是一天一个样,为了一个特定事件专门来个政策。所谓国无恒法。) A1 X  B3 V1 [/ X% T7 s8 n6 N
6 h7 m% }8 g, [1 w* Z2 a6 F2 _; C$ n5 X
再说,他们觉得income trust税务投机,怎么就不检讨一下税为什么那么高?税制为什么那么复杂?打个比方。税制就像微软Windows,可以谴责利用视窗漏洞的木马病毒,但根源本身还在它自己结构上就有漏洞。加拿大税率在西方发达国家本来就是高的,再这样小动作不断,商业竞争力将越来越弱。
您需要登录后才可以回帖 登录 | 注册

本版积分规则

联系我们|小黑屋|手机版|Archiver|埃德蒙顿中文网

GMT-7, 2024-5-7 07:12 , Processed in 0.131409 second(s), 22 queries , Gzip On, APC On.

Powered by Discuz! X3.4

Copyright © 2001-2021, Tencent Cloud.

快速回复 返回顶部 返回列表